An opinion on and suggestion for the Artists/Writer Wanted Boards.

[Robin Rain]

You know... I might be stepping out of line here, but I really have been questioning the usefulness of the Manga Artists/Writer Boards for a while now.

In theory they're a wonderful way to meet new friends or teammates to work towards your goal with... But in reality.... How many people even get a reply there that isn't to criticize the offer? I know I'm guilty of doing that too, but really... It's become a source of stress here when the site is supposed to be helpful and fun.

I know that completely removing the boards is probably out of the question, so I have another suggestion. I'm not sure of the inner works of this forum, but is there a way to set the permissions on those boards to be "topic post only" and "no replies"? This way they can still advertise their request and still receive offers through the PM system without the drama that currently resides there.

As for how they can keep their topic active without posting a new one frequently.... Wouldn't becoming more active in the other writing/drawing boards help with that? Especially if they were to put the link to their thread in their signature?

I don't mean to offend anyone and I'm not directing it at any specific person. Anyways, this may or may not be an unpopular opinion, but I had to at least bring it up.

[legomaestro]

People failing to listen to the forum rules is the actual problem here more than anything. I'll clean out what I can, and will be PMing the more common perpetrators to remind them how it works.

In terms of helpfulness, people can always offer collaborations if they want. But if they want professional help its always going to come down to how much money they're willing to offer or not.

[Hasith]

I have been thinking about this problem for a while. Original idea was to give members a chance to ask for teammates and announce their planned projects. But people just come here to post only in that part which is not productive for forum.

I know what you mean Robin but just letting them to post topics only wont be helpful either. People come here just to find a teammate and then vanish doesn't help forum. Since most people here just for that we are moving away from original goal of the forum and just becoming an advertising board.

I guess we need to take more control over what happens there. Main problem is people come here and join the forum just to advertise. Mainly because if you search Google for " Manga artist wanted " we are at top of the result. So newbies coming here to find a mate and experienced people come here to advertise them selves and find work. But they have no interest to stick around so they are not exactly great members for forum at all. They never become regular members. Plus most of them don't even bother about forum rules and just post what they want. That usually where they get not so friendly replies.

I want to make few specific rules and policies for those 2 boards rather than removing the whole thing. Maybe we should allow these sections only for members who has been here at least a month or 2 and also make certain amount of posts/contribution.

Also set of guidelines before apply for artist / writer request topic. Same about those artists who like to advertise their services. Then delete/lock topics which haven't comply with our rules and guidelines.

I'm open for suggestions.

[Crystal (BobbyjoeX)]

ever since i came here and heard about the issue i came up with the term "Pitch 'n Ditch" which means you put your pitch, advertisement, what have you, get what you came here for and then *censored* off. so there should be a rule that says "No Pitch 'n Ditching: if you are not going to be apart of the community, Leave"

there should also be a rule about forcing one of the members they got to hire to pay for fees and bills cause i have seen that twice now where they go "im looking for an artist/writer, but the artist/writer that im looking for has to pay for [insert something really *censored*ing expensive here]" and yeah make it like 20 posts and they cant be all "im looking for bleh" over and over and over again

i could go on but my mind turned to mush at the moment

[a]

Personally, I think it's just the nature of a website like this. I don't think there's much you can realistically do.


At the end of the day, the cream will always rise to the top.

[MahluaandMilk]

Yeah, it really is a shame that there isn't much more we can do except gently chide them about the rules, although sometimes that seems to get quite a negative response. I'm sure I've been called the B word plenty of times behind my back for it. Now I just idly drop in to point out when a rule has been broken and try to suggest browsing around and actually looking at the artist galleries around here, and while I could be more thorough in my suggestions, I tend to find myself wondering if they're even worth it.

What I have seen, though, is a group of newbies that came together and started working on their own few discussion topics. Granted, I haven't dug through and figured out what's going on in them, but I'd say that's some kind of progress.

[Hasith]

Well yes. New people get a chance to make groups or teams to do projects together. It's a good things. Since most of them come here just to find team mates and leave the forum it's not actually beneficial for our forum. They just use forum as advertising board to find what they want.

Our goal is  providing a place for people who are too shy or afraid to post their drawings / stories in public because of negative reactions they might receive. We encourage others to post their artwork in public, members  helping other members by giving advice to improve their skills.

Even idea of these Request boards are to let regular members to find other members for their projects to get free help like having a character created by artist. We didn't put lots of rules and guidelines since Regulars would know what they are doing.

Right now 99% of requests are from new members who have no interest to be a part of MR but just to find someone to draw their stuff for free. When they find someone they just move the whole thing outside the forum and some even request their account deleted. After a while some of them return to forum just to send me PMs asking me to ban some others coz they vanished from their projects or for fights happened in their outside projects. Even thought I don't even bother to reply something this pisses me off like hell.

So lets see what we rules and guidelines we can put get this sorted out.

01. Having at least 25 posts and 2 weeks time in forum before posting in the request boards.

02. Writers must have a story thread posted in writers section if they looking for an artist.

03. Artists looking for paid work must have a Art Gallery.  Also they do have to help other members before starting their Paid commission threads.

04. Request topics need to be approved by a mod before it's published. This is force everyone to read and comply with rules and guidelines before have their thread open for public.

05. If you requesting an artist or writer then you can't ask them to bare any or all  costs. Well If it's an collaboration then you can say team mates can share any costs.

06. No more outside links in request threads.  like read my story here in this site or check by art here in DA. This just makes their loyalty other sites and we are just an advertising board.


So plz tell what you guys think about these. Anything you might find good or bad about these or even improvements for this if you can think of any.  Also we need to have a set of guidelines for those who respond for these request topics too.

[Crystal (BobbyjoeX)]

i still Suggest no Pitch 'n Ditching, if you pitch your story or request on the site you have to contribute to the site

[Vacant]

I think those rules are a really good idea. Having a grace period will prevent the one post and dash approach. Also having their art here increases activity for the boards and engagement so it's win win.

I agree with Robin that we've all been guilty of posting in these posts to reaffirm the rules that ultimately leads to negative comments and prove fruitless.

So maybe a rule telling members to NOT reply unless interested in the offer. If the post is in breach of the rules then leave it to the mods. That should stop any drama.

[Nomena :)]

01. Having at least 25 posts and 2 weeks time in forum before posting in the request boards.

This sounds good if it could be automated, otherwise you'll have a lot of work to do

02. Writers must have a story thread posted in writers section if they looking for an artist.

Sounds good as well, though I would like to suggest a STORYBOARD section

I, for example, am very UNLIKELY to ever consider working with a writer who is unable to make storyboards on a story that is not mine...it takes a lot of skill to do this and people need to start learning and getting better at it if they want a better chance to find unpaid collaborations or at least potentially lower the page price.

Still storyboards do not guaranty finding free workers, so I don't want to give false hopes to anyone, but I still think it's a valuable skill that anyone wanting to make comics and manga must have. I don't agree with people who say they are not even able to draw stick figures. And it's not only about stick figures but also about paneling, pacing and balancing dialogue/text content

03. Artists looking for paid work must have a Art Gallery.  Also they do have to help other members before starting their Paid commission threads.

I think having an art gallery is sufficient, not everyone is capable of giving constructive criticism and it shouldn't hinder their right to be commissioned.

04. Request topics need to be approved by a mod before it's published. This is force everyone to read and comply with rules and guidelines before have their thread open for public.

This is a really good idea but then again it depends on all the mods, it looks like a lot of work for you.

05. If you requesting an artist or writer then you can't ask them to bare any or all  costs. Well If it's an collaboration then you can say team mates can share any costs.

Yes and also sometimes I see people saying "Paid" and then write "pay after successfully published", it sounds dumb and ridiculous.

But then again, getting stingy on costs is not a good idea given that it's already difficult enough to find collaboration...the one who is requesting should be willing to make all sacrifices.

06. No more outside links in request threads.  like read my story here in this site or check by art here in DA. This just makes their loyalty other sites and we are just an advertising board.

Yes, good idea

[Walter B]

but I really have been questioning the usefulness of the Manga Artists/Writer Boards for a while now.

I think the same.  But the reason for this is not about the rules, or even people who fail to read the rules. The reason is nobody works for free.

[Carshald]

but I really have been questioning the usefulness of the Manga Artists/Writer Boards for a while now.

Honestly me too.  But the reason for this is not about the rules, or even people who fail to read the rules. The reason is quite simple:

Finding an artist willing to work on your story for free is nearly impossible.

There are a lot people who are starting out in this whole mangaka thing. Maybe they have a story they are really excited about. They make a post about it and say something like "I can't pay an artist at the moment but we can split the profit if this becomes popular". Yeahhhhh..right  . Those who have been in this world for a while know that you are not going to find any good artist willing to draw a 20+ pages manga for free. It just doesn't happen. You have better chances of winning the lottery 

I think the UNPAID manga artist request thing is near useless.  BUT, useless as it is, I think we should keep it. Why? Because at least it makes new members feel like they are actually trying to go somewhere with their project. Let them have this board as some kind of starting place. If they stick around, they will learn that you actually need to become part of the community and interact a little bit if you want to find someone willing to help you out.

I completely agree mate! Probably why I personally gave up and just decided to find a commisioned artist! I mean it's not completely impossible, you just have to become bff's with the artist, write a story that the artist will love so much he's willing to spend w.e time he/she has to do it for free. But that's just my opinion 

[Crystal (BobbyjoeX)]

i finally came to the idea, yeah lets just get rid of the Artist/writer wanted boards...

just have one locked thread that only the mods can edit, that lists all the available artists/writers

[Walter B]

An idea is to split the board in paid and unpaid:

http://forums.mangaraiders.com/index.php/topic,17872.0.html

[Crystal (BobbyjoeX)]

i'll admit, i am in a *censored* mood so this will be pretty harsh, very harsh actually but i tried to keep it as "civil" as possible..

i put it under a spoiler, so i can put a warning, harsh... or i think its harsh

Spoiler

i'll just say it, THAT DOESNT HELP THE PROBLEM it doesnt change anything, i saw a few people, they wont even make a gallery for their art, then someone recently up and said "im not here to socialize, im only here for an artist"... THEN LEAVE!! we dont want those people here, we want a community, not people going "i want a job" then go somewhere else and dont let the door hit you in the ass on the way out

the best thing is to have ONE topic in the board, where you have to contact a mod to be on the list of available people and if they dont follow the requirements, they get a rejected message back.

 we dont want new people on the boards, we dont care "oh they are a good artist  and we need those types of people"(completely throwing THE REST OF US UNDER THE GODDAMN BUS, GLAD TO KNOW THE REST OF US ARE *censored* ARTISTS) if they dont want to contribute to the community, we didnt want them to begin with