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Author Topic: Suuper's Artworks & Illustrations  (Read 310719 times)

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Offline Manimal

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Re: Suuper's manga (now includes digital!)
« Reply #375 on: March 06, 2016, 12:32:12 PM »
See that's more..dynamic already but yes KillerB's points say it all. She like has two different parts! But you know you'll get it better the more you do it, I'm sure you don't need me to say that! But ya doing stuff like that is much more exciting you know. It's easy and fun to draw straight on shots all the time but you gotta introduce challenges to yourself sometimes.

Offline Suuper-san

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Re: Suuper's manga (now includes digital!)
« Reply #376 on: March 06, 2016, 12:41:51 PM »
its a real shame i mucked it up otherwise it might have looked pretty good :P
yeah i tend to default to front shots when i am not thinking, i have been trying to fix that very recently the suggestion to redraw it was a great idea for me.
normally i would not have messed up a drawing that bad though. i am totally blaming it on being tired :P
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Offline Manimal

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Re: Suuper's manga (now includes digital!)
« Reply #377 on: March 06, 2016, 12:44:23 PM »
You don't have to worry so much about it man, it's not as if that's the only time you can ever draw it!

Offline Suuper-san

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Re: Suuper's manga (now includes digital!)
« Reply #378 on: March 06, 2016, 12:53:42 PM »
yeah i know :P
its just the amount of time to spend on it was unusually high, and the results were unusually low :P
im not depressed (anymore) though :P
although i will probably redraw it as many times in as many poses until i get fed up :P
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Offline Manimal

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Re: Suuper's manga (now includes digital!)
« Reply #379 on: March 06, 2016, 01:00:01 PM »
I know the feel dude. I've drawn so many things, even coloured them, looked at them later and wanted to puke everywhere. Sometimes when you draw and you get really into it you don't realize the mistakes. It's like your so in the zone you don't realize you drew a character with freaky arms or unnatural clothes folds whatever it may be. There is nothing else to say on the matter expect for the ever cliche ever true keep tryin'.

Offline Suuper-san

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Re: Suuper's manga (now includes digital!)
« Reply #380 on: March 06, 2016, 01:07:22 PM »
It's like your so in the zone you don't realize
yes. that.
thanks for the pep talk, once again i will challenge the world :P
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Offline Suuper-san

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Re: Suuper's manga (now includes digital!)
« Reply #381 on: March 28, 2016, 07:05:40 PM »
Just got over a really bad virus which is why i havnt been posting so much since i have been back
Started off for a change with a couple of random panels, really working on composition rather than proportions etc

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Offline RobotWizardZ

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Re: Suuper's manga (now includes digital!)
« Reply #382 on: March 28, 2016, 09:27:37 PM »
This has given me hope seeing you progress page mby page practise really does make perfect can't wait to start as soon as my tablet arrives

Offline Ryan

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Re: Suuper's manga (now includes digital!)
« Reply #383 on: March 28, 2016, 10:20:21 PM »
Just got over a really bad virus which is why i havnt been posting so much since i have been back
Started off for a change with a couple of random panels, really working on composition rather than proportions etc



These are fairly successful panels. Good work you've been doing lately, as I haven't posted here in a while I think. Anyways, in terms of advice, I would say that thinking of things more in terms of form is important for you to get to the next level.

And although it is just my opinion, I think you are in the trap of doing 'quick studies.' I'm seeing that you are frequently making fairly big and noticeable mistakes in your proportions in these quick studies. Accuracy isn't the end-all, but it's important. My form/technique and drawing became a lot more nuanced from doing longer drawings and studies; in fact, I would say it's one of the most important things I've gained from my art classes. So, this is why I say to slow down(do longer studies)! In ways I was quite similar to you... A large variety of parameters(time,goal,effort) in your studies is necessary to get a strong sight of things and knack for drawing. Without this, one's studying is much less effective.

A concrete solution would be to start with doing 1-hour long studies of images. Use hb or harder so you can erase. Good-quality(and pencil, not pen) paper will be helpful(but not mandatory) if you decide to do it traditionally. I would say to not do long studies on animation screencaps, as animation isn't as much about drawing as it is about animation. Remember, anime expresses through movement; manga is like animation without inbetweens and only the most important shots. All of the important moments, and money shots, are already there, hand-picked for you. The mangaka put a lot of effort in to making some of these drawings to the best of their ability. If you've ever watched Yusuke Murata draw his manga, he erases over and over until he finds a drawing to his standard.

Lastly, if copying from a manga, consider the actual size it was originally drawn in so that you can more easily draw the nuances in the image (generally, B4).

Lastly but not lastly? What? Okay, for real this time. http://www.dorian-iten.com/accuracy/ This is a free-guide that goes over the essence of what goes into achieving accuracy. It's simplified the most important aspects in attaining accuracy and can serve as a strong road map for training it. Anyways, it's up to you for what you should do, but these are my thoughts overall on your current drawings, and how I think you'd be able to put more nuance and effective style into your drawings. I know it's a lot of content here, but think of it as making up for all the time I was away  ;D

Offline Suuper-san

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Re: Suuper's manga (now includes digital!)
« Reply #384 on: March 29, 2016, 11:23:30 AM »
thanks for your detailed comments Ryan, i appreciate it.
now to return with an even more complicated reply :P

i must admit, i do do a LOT of short studies, in fact i dont do any long studies. i think thats partly because i break down the study into an individual body part, like a hand or arm, and just practice that, so a 1m drawing of a hand would have been a 10-20 minute study of the whole body. yeah drawing a whole person is also good practice i dont do any long time studies at all really. i will give it a shot, but i cant say i will ike it, but i dare say i will thank you afterwards :P

but i must also secondarily admit, i am never in my top form for drawing. i dont mean that as in an excuse "this is only half my power - this is my real power!!!!!" but i draw when i am dead tired a lot of the time and i just plain dont notice the mistakes, when i normally would (at least, i think i would).
yes that sounds lame and you are saying why dont i sleep then if i am tired. i think its when i am not tired, i am at work or stuff, and the only time i have left is when i am tired at the end of the day.

also i wasnt sure if you meant those panels nor not, but those ones are not studies, i made them up on my own.

and regarding them, i drew with a lot less guidelines, yesterday i was all about "feeling" the drawing, no idea why.
i am an idiot thats why :P

thanks for the guide , i will take a look. i do like the help links you post they are really good.
you are like the gateway to good links :P

not do long studies on animation screencaps
yes. i rarely spend more than 30 seconds on anime reference. i am more likely to spend time on the manga reference for the reasons you basically pointed out. manga is a much better reference if you plan on drawing manga, not only for the panels and composition reference, but the line quality and shading/hatching etc are copiable, whereas in anime they are not very high quality :P

Lastly, if copying from a manga, consider the actual size it was originally drawn in so that you can more easily draw the nuances in the image (generally, B4).
i always automatically enlarge when copying by 50%, dont know why can cant control it very well. when copying a whole page, i am limited to A4 though. i dont and probably never will have B4. i have never even seen it in real life.

overall, i will work on longer more detailed (+full body) studies as suggested.
i will try and draw when not tired to see if there is any difference in quality :P
but.....you will never take away my pen :P
nah i will try pencil again but i hate sharpening pencils.
oh yeah i have mechanical ones now :P

@ryan do you have any comments on mechanical pencil vs pencil pencil?

sorry the post went on for so long :P
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Offline Ryan

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Re: Suuper's manga (now includes digital!)
« Reply #385 on: March 29, 2016, 02:58:22 PM »
Quote
but i must also secondarily admit, i am never in my top form for drawing. i dont mean that as in an excuse "this is only half my power - this is my real power!!!!!" but i draw when i am dead tired a lot of the time and i just plain dont notice the mistakes, when i normally would (at least, i think i would).
yes that sounds lame and you are saying why dont i sleep then if i am tired. i think its when i am not tired, i am at work or stuff, and the only time i have left is when i am tired at the end of the day.

I was fearful of this before, actually, as I'm aware you're employed. If you know for sure what your MBTI type is, that would help show part of the picture for your development. Drawing when you're tired, likely, relies on intuition and muscle memory. This is in contrast to when you are present, where you are able to actively engage your memory/bank of experience, any systems of drawing you know, and it's theoretically possible to see problems before they arise. I would like to nickname this 'slow-thought' drawing. This is really, to be honest, the mode that is key to improving. The 'deliberate practice' that you hear so much of. I think you know this as well; there's really no other way around it, so I won't go on about it further. Practicing while you are tired will only make you more tired as the lack of sleep builds up, further marginalizing your efforts.. :P

Regarding drawing with feeling, this is actually a good way of drawing, especially for creativity. Strict guidelines can lead to sameface syndrome. The key for this style, I think, is still being present! Haha..umm  :hmm:, drawing with feeling should be fairly calm, and slow. You should be looking at your drawing every step of the way and be gentle with your strokes, so you can harden the 'good' lines later on in the sketch. Drawing with feeling can bring the idea of not caring or going with the flow, although those really won't get you anywhere :P It's a low-energy way of drawing.

I have to run, but I will edit this later for more things.

Offline Suuper-san

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Re: Suuper's manga (now includes digital!)
« Reply #386 on: March 29, 2016, 03:45:15 PM »
yeah my brain switches off but i still want to draw something. like i want to achieve something.

although i have actually been getting over a condition that was suffering for 2 years that actually affected my memory and focus, so its possibly a lag from that, whenever i am ill (as i am now as well) it gets even worse, until i am fully recovered.

basically i should not have been out of bed, let alone drawing.

If you know for sure what your MBTI type is
i did two online tests and both graded me as INFJ, didnt really mean much to me, since over half the questions cant be answered on a yes-no/1-10 scale. so i dont know for sure, but seems like it :P

the reason i try and draw with feeling is to push my expressiveness beyond "that which i know" and try to draw things that i have not yet learnt, or cannot yet draw, or dont know what looks like. mostly its about getting over the thought "i dont know how to draw that yet"

i also tried to go for exaggeration, because in manga i believe you have to express the peak of the emotion because the readers dont see outside the pictures, you have to tell them exactly how excited/sad/happy the characters were etc.
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Offline Suuper-san

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Re: Suuper's manga (now includes digital!)
« Reply #387 on: March 29, 2016, 05:57:36 PM »
i couldnt sleep :P
latest, just working a bit on proportions and angles and stuff
i redrew the hands and feet because the scale was too small to add detail (i was drawing with a hard board backing and the pen started to follow the texture)
it feels like i am relearning everything i forgot in the last 3 weeks, you can see the immediate improvement between the left and right profile images (both face and body)



now time to sleep :P
« Last Edit: March 29, 2016, 06:03:36 PM by suupertramp »
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Offline Ryan

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Re: Suuper's manga (now includes digital!)
« Reply #388 on: March 29, 2016, 11:45:27 PM »
Quote
you are like the gateway to good links :P
Thank you for that, I'm like a library when it comes to anything I'm really interested in  ;)

Regarding the panels, I know that they were created by you, don't worry.

Quote
do you have any comments on mechanical pencil vs pencil pencil?
Spoiler
Personally, I don't have a preference for sketching. I have a preference for using regular pencils when drawing on higher-quality drawing paper, or any 'big' subject matter on big paper. You can't really get a large range of motion with a mechanical pencil on large paper, so it's definitely inferior for when you're making bigger drawings, at least in the first stage of starting a drawing.

In terms of what mostly everyone here is interested in, mechanical pencil is probably the best, 0.5mm as well. There are many reasons mangaka use mechanical pencils for drafting. They're cheap, don't need to be sharpened, and they feel nice to draw with. But besides that, you can achieve a variety of line easily. You can get thin lines, and then thicker lines by going over your lines repeatedly. Pencils dull quickly and you obviously don't get this variety of line unless you're sharpening frequently.

Some things to consider when using mechanical pencils is your lead type. HB, B, 2B, and 3B are your options, generally. These can make a difference; not everyone just uses HB by default. HB is the hardest of these bunch, 3B the softest. The softness can help prevent that 'sharp' feeling you can sometimes get from drawing with a mechanical pencil.

Anyways, I am more picky about the paper I use. You will never catch me drawing on printer paper. It's just not worth it when there are other thicker, affordable papers you might be able to find. This is something I think beginners often overlook and they will have a much more enjoyable drawing experience if they get a better paper to use.

Regarding troubles with drawing things 1:1, you should try something like this out.
Spoiler
It's not the easiest thing to set up, but after you've done it one time it should be pretty easy after that. Set up the PSD as 8.5 x 11, 200 dpi should be fine. Input an image, crop out what you want, and resize it until the width is 1/2 of the PSD canvas width. Then draw a thin box around the image that you're drawing on a new layer. Duplicate the thin box layer and drag it to the side while holding control. Print it out, and then you can use the box as a reference for getting the proportions more accurate. You are also better able to see the differences in your studies by doing this.

Quote
although i have actually been getting over a condition that was suffering for 2 years that actually affected my memory and focus, so its possibly a lag from that, whenever i am ill (as i am now as well) it gets even worse, until i am fully recovered.
That sucks :(. Well, I'm glad that you are getting over the condition. Focus can be pretty important.

About the MBTI-thing, my type is different than what I've tested for in the past. Reading stuff from personalityhacker and 16personality types is a better way to figure it out, I think, I just asked in the off-chance that you already knew :P.

Quote
the reason i try and draw with feeling is to push my expressiveness beyond "that which i know" and try to draw things that i have not yet learnt, or cannot yet draw, or dont know what looks like. mostly its about getting over the thought "i dont know how to draw that yet"

If you think about this logically, you are gambling by doing this. It's similar to trying to get a monkey to randomly type a sentence of English. Or trying to get a chess ai to play go. The knowledge isn't there. Art is partially difficult because you can't brute-force being able to draw things by sheer effort. It's why some beginners or layman can't get past a single starting point. Any progress that is made for any person is going to because they actually have been looking at what things look like, or even making studies of real objects, and using this to fuel their drawings.

That's not to say you can't put things together, or invent things. But you can't invent something that is a real object in reality by accident without knowing already what it looks like. You could be able to draw 99% of the animals in the world, you still wouldn't be able to invent the other 1%. Anyways, the moral of the story is: there are a few categories to be aware of, that relate to the ability to draw objects that would require you to have at least seen them once before.

1.Things you can actually draw accurately and you are aware of them
2.Things you already are capable of drawing accurately, but you don't recognize this ability
3.Things you don't know how to draw and you are aware that you can't draw them accurately
4.Things that are mutations of real things. Or a certain style of drawing things. These things are likely to be reminiscent of Rob Liefield, or horribly inaccurate, invented anatomy. It is a mismatch in that you've actually created a different thing that is similar to the real thing, but is really a mutation. These things(the mutations) can also exist in the other categories, such as styles you are trying to learn to use!


The 'things' that exist in each category are free to move between categories, based on your thoughts/efforts, or lack of thoughts/efforts. If you think by drawing 'expressively' that you are pushing past 'what you already know', you are actually moving things from #2 to #1, or creating a #4 thing, I think. It's important to mention that repeating the drawings of things in #4 without ever looking at the real object, or descriptions of the real object, will not get you closer to drawing the real thing. You can mistakenly believe you've succeeded at doing so, but you actually created a new, original, mutation object in #1.

Sorry for saying a lot of things again .-.
« Last Edit: March 29, 2016, 11:49:53 PM by Ryan »

Offline Suuper-san

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Re: Suuper's manga (now includes digital!)
« Reply #389 on: April 01, 2016, 06:32:54 AM »
yes, if i am trying to force a 1:1 drawing i will box it in, and that works quite well if i need to do it. if i dont have any guidelines though it will always be larger.

regarding the drawing things that i cannot draw, i dont think i meant it exactly the way you understood it. yes drawing something that you cannot draw is counter intuitive. what i mean, is drawing something that you know what is like by its description, but dont know the exact lines to draw it with.

say for example, a happy face. most non-artists can draw a happy face, that a no brainer. so its using the basic knowledge (wider eyes, higher eyebrows, raised corners of mouth) and applying it to your drawing of a face, but you dont know exactly how to apply it. its sort of like trial and error where you say well that didnt work, work out why and draw it again trying to avoid the failure.
also i mean drawing things that i cannot draw in the sence that i try and draw from memory, but not something that i have previously studdied. like i have never hardly drawn a car, but i know what they look like because i see them everyday. so its trying to force your memory to retrieve those details that you know you know, but have never drawn before. doing a lot of this would not have too much benefit, but i think a small session every now and then tests your "artist" skill, rather than your ability to copy something in front of you. the pressure also gears your brain and your analysis to be more observant in your daily life.

i do spend most of my time studying stuff though, but its nice to try and see what your raw ability is for something you havent drawn before.

Sorry for saying a lot of things again .-.
not at all, i appreciate the time you spend to help me improve :P
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