March 02, 2024, 04:10:41 PM

------------------------------------------

If you have Login Problems Use the Login in Top Menu Bar


------------------------------------------
If you have a problem registering here, Leave a msg at our FB Page >> Here.

Plz Don't use Hotmail to Register. You might not receive Activation mail. Use Other free mail provider like Gmail or Yahoo.






Author Topic: I Never Left Without Saying Goodbye [Discussion]  (Read 5862 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Albi

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 21
  • Gender: Male
  • Have fun and go far
    • View Profile
I Never Left Without Saying Goodbye [Discussion]
« on: May 07, 2020, 06:09:00 PM »
Feel free to ask or comment anything here for the my story;

I Never Left Without Saying Goodbye: http://forums.mangaraiders.com/index.php/topic,19794.0.html

Updates:
-small changes to chapter 3 and 6, to better line up chapter 7
« Last Edit: May 08, 2020, 06:46:26 AM by Albi »

Offline Coryn

  • Director of the MR Science Division
  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 21542
  • Gender: Male
  • Secretly a 13 year old girl.
    • View Profile
Re: I Never Left Without Saying Goodbye [Discussion]
« Reply #1 on: June 02, 2020, 11:03:52 PM »
Ah, I see you're actually using the discussion board there Albi. Can't say I've ever been a fan of separating stories from story discussion, but hey, maybe I'm just old school?

I read chapter 1 so far (cramming this in at the end of the day). You've definitely got an interesting start going! My main critique is for formatting and tense. With the formatting, you have a lot of paragraph breaks where they shouldn't be. If a character is having dialogue for instance, you don't need to add a paragraph break when you pause for a sentence or two of prose. So for instance, the paragraph:

The bunny still holding onto its ears, looked at the man, “Me!? You first jackass!” the bunny stomps its feet in annoyance.

“I was being nice and all to check on you and what do I get? You screaming at my face!”


Should be made into just a single paragraph. There's also a fair few common sense issuess I think are coming from not giving your writing a thorough enough edit. A few times there are missing or misused punctuation marks. Other times there are dropped letters. For instance the line: "I feel like I’m in a dream or in one of those children’s fantasy book" should be:  "I feel like I’m in a dream or in one of those childrens' fantasy books," (Note the change to multiple children, multiple books, and the comma as it did not mark the end of the sentence in the original context.

The last formatting thing is that you kept swapping between past and present tense. Remember: past tense verbs tend to end with a hard "D", (jumped, gambled, attacked). While present tense verbs tend to end with an "S", (jumps, gambles, attacks). These can be easy to mess up if you don't practice separating them when first deciding what tense to write in.


Finally, I would like a little more information on the guy. We know that he's a guy, but that's it. To some degree I understand you want to obscure anything about his identity at this point, but right now I have no context for what he looks like, his age, what kind of clothes he's wearing, what time period he's from. Since we get at least a little information on the bunny, it would make sense to get the equivalent for the guy.

That's all I've got for now. It's a fun concept, so I'll definitely continue reading!

Will review stories upon request. My latest arc: http://goo.gl/KYgsfF

Offline Coryn

  • Director of the MR Science Division
  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 21542
  • Gender: Male
  • Secretly a 13 year old girl.
    • View Profile
Re: I Never Left Without Saying Goodbye [Discussion]
« Reply #2 on: June 03, 2020, 10:17:22 PM »
Chapter 2 time.


God I do love a good living skeleton. The whole fitness wear thing is definitely a bit weird, but I'm interested to see where you go with it! Medusa lady definitely seems a lot less friendly than good old Benial (even if he is a skeleton whose soul seems to be constantly trying to escape).

I won't get on about the same formatting stuff as I did in the first chapter. They are pretty much apply here too. One new thing I did pick up on is your dialogue since you have a little more of it this time around. And this is a bit more of a holistic bit of advice so bear with me.

It seems like when the man was giving his pep talk, he wasn't taking enough breaths. By that I mean your sentences of dialogue ran on a bit long. Now, your first clue with this is often just reading it through and like a regular run-on sentence, thinking there hasn't been a period in a minute. And if you think about this it makes a lot of sense right? When a person speaks, they need to breathe. When a person breathes they take a pause and the dialogue pauses for a moment. In dialogue, a period can be taken as a breath, with the speaker breathing in between each sentence. If you go back and read your own dialogue out loud (I'm being generic here, not calling you out directly), it quickly becomes obvious when a piece of dialogue isn't working. If you have to pause for breath, or get tongue tied in the middle of a sentence, then you have found where you need to rework your dialogue.

For this reason, I always advocate reading your entire story out loud to yourself during the edit. You're always going to find something to smooth out.


I'm looking forward to the next chapter!

Will review stories upon request. My latest arc: http://goo.gl/KYgsfF

Offline Albi

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 21
  • Gender: Male
  • Have fun and go far
    • View Profile
Re: I Never Left Without Saying Goodbye [Discussion]
« Reply #3 on: June 05, 2020, 12:46:14 AM »
Many thanks for the point outs, I'll be heavily keeping those in mind (0 ^ 0)7

Just to note, I won't be updating this story anytime soon but I'll see what i can do (= v =)

Offline Coryn

  • Director of the MR Science Division
  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 21542
  • Gender: Male
  • Secretly a 13 year old girl.
    • View Profile
Re: I Never Left Without Saying Goodbye [Discussion]
« Reply #4 on: June 05, 2020, 09:31:03 AM »
No worries man! We aren't beholden to addressing every comment we get. It's just something to pay attention to going forward. Like I said the worst of it I think can be picked up by thorough editing. Get that into the routine and quality will leap forward. Not to mention, the edit is a great time to come up with better ideas than the ones you had previously

Will review stories upon request. My latest arc: http://goo.gl/KYgsfF

Offline NO1SY

  • Resident Slacker
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3318
  • Gender: Male
  • Will eat your cookies
    • View Profile
Re: I Never Left Without Saying Goodbye [Discussion]
« Reply #5 on: June 08, 2020, 07:10:23 PM »
Hello Albi (Not a racist dragon I hope...), and a belated welcome to MR!

I have just finished reading through all 7 chapters of your story here and.... Wow that was quite the journey huh!


Firstly let me just say that recently in my reading career I have learned to really appreciate shorter more concise stories that end! So yours definitely fit that bill. I did a quick word count, and all 7 chapters combined come out at roughly 10500 words. This is not quite long enough for your standard light novel (50000 words) but is sizeable enough for a one-shot short story, and I don’t think your cliff-hangers would suffer too much if you were to remove the chapter divides and just make sure that everything was properly formatted.


Now please allow me to offer a review of the story - for everyone else, this will contain spoilers and I highly recommend giving Albi’s work a read for yourself first before hearing anything I have to say about it! Also it may seem at points that I am being overly critical, but I promise you that this is not an attack; merely critique and suggestions for how I think the story could improve :)


First things first, as with more projects posted on the site, the whole story needs proof-reading and copy-editing - There are many instances of grammatical errors and missing punctuation / letters throughout that can be ironed out easily with a copy-edit.

Just a few select, very obvious examples to me were:


Spoiler

Chapter 1 Line 1 is written in past tense, but Line 3 switches to present tense. BIG NO! (Also, your story is predominantly written in present tense, which almost never reads as well as past tense...)

Chapter 1 Line 6: “Almost really” is a juxtaposed redundancy, and it is probably better to choose one word or the other.

Chapter 3: When Joan says “Because I didn’t mean to...” it should be a new line so that it is clear that it is a new speaker.




And now on to the main event!:

Spoiler

I think I’ll just get it out of the way straight up... Why a rabbit? (“Because it is cute“ is a perfectly legitimate reason here by the way!)

Following on from that, lets go with ‘OK she’s a rabbit!’: then I think you could make more of the rabbit’s mannerisms more rabbit-like than you have currently. In chapter 1 line 12 for instance, instead of “the bunny stomps its feet in annoyance” why not use language more associated with rabbits, something like, “the aggregated bunny thumps it’s hind leg on the ground in a quick triplet.” - I did a quick google search of “Rabbit foot thumping” and found out they do this when they feel anxious or threatened to warn other nearby rabbits of the danger. In my opinion, this would also provide a greater misdirect about the rabbit’s identity before the reveal in chapter 2. Side note: chapter 1 line 22... can bunnies even pout!?

Switching gears, I’m not quite sure that the way you had the man solve the dilemma in Chapter 2 is all that convincing or satisfying. Benial’s dog has been missing (which in and of itself is weird considering that they are in a room with 2 closed doors) for 5 days and rather than suggesting that there is still hope of finding the dog, the man just up and tells him to get over it. Now, say that they find some dog bones in a weird place or even just behind where Benial is sitting, and had it have been 5 years rather than 5 days, then sure, everything else you’ve written seems good (maybe have them kick the dog bones out of sight of Benial once they get him up and moving again or something...)! Now, in hindsight I suspect 5 days is the time frame since the accident... but I’m not really sure about the relevance of the dog or Daniel to be honest!?

Chapter 5 runs the risk of feeling similar to chapter 2 with they way that the dialogue is written. However, when I paraphrased to summarise what was actually said, what I got from it was:
1) Man says that by constantly trying to fix the botched ending of that one book, Joan is unable to write any other stories/all of his other stories always ended basically the same way, and so he isn’t progressing as a writer, so maybe he should just give up (actually ok logic when applied solely to writing a book!).
2) Bunny says maybe Joan needs outside inspiration to write something new or different, but won’t share their story, (In fairness they don’t know their whole story yet either). They conclude that in life, you can never really tell what’s going to come next so how could Joan the author plan the perfect ending to his story (a little contrived, considering the role of an author...).
3) Then they convince Joan that the story he wrote hasn’t really ended yet anyway because he is still alive to write something? Or that Joan can put this story down and start a new, original one to move past his failure regardless?
Breaking it down like this it seems like ok logic, avoiding a situation like chapter 2, but I think that you have struggled to put it into words and this section could do with a little bit of a re-write. Again, in hindsight I understand the foreshadowing of chapters 4 and 5, I just think that the reasoning here has to be told through much clearer dialogue.

On the topic of logical development, I would have liked to have seen some more natural connections form between the Man and the rabbit prior to and outside of the flashbacks. For instance, some indications that the man was saying things that resonated in the heart of the rabbit or giving her a sense of deja vu. Moreover, in the first chapter and a half before the flashback, you should definitely establish character mannerisms and quirks that readers will then see emulated in the memories after. This connects the current characters to the characters in the memories in a much stronger way than just saying that “Oh the man is the boy and the bunny is the girl” ever could, and without these things the relationship in the memories feels less real.

In Chapter 7 we are shown that the event was clearly an accident, yet bunny-girl keeps calling herself a failure, which seems like an unreasonable characterisation of the situation. Survivor’s guilt i understand, a sense of loss is expected, maybe even a sense of loathing for the cruelty of the universe, but I’m not sure that I can buy into self-chastisement here... It is also unclear whether or not the woman also lost the baby in the cliff accident. If no, and her added grief is just that she never told the Man he was going to be a father or something like that, then what you have written after seems mostly fine. But if she lost the baby as well, it makes it very hard to swallow when the man and the priestess are acting so cheery in the next few lines, and then they all laugh (including the bunny) at the ridiculousness of the situation.

In fact, a major take-away that I got after finishing and digesting what I had read was that there is a COLOSSAL tone shift in the last couple of chapters, whereby the story goes from almost romantic absurdist comedy, to complete romantic tragedy. Now I kind of worked out where things were going by about chapter 3 or 4, and yet the final chapter still got a lump in my throat so good job there (although it is well known that I am a massive, overly empathic sap, so...). What that means though is that even though I knew what to expect, the change in tone still felt very jarring.

Lastly, and quite importantly. Another thing that is hard for readers with how you have written this is that we enter the very first scene of the story through the perspective of the Man. I was going to suggest that he be focused on more as the 3rd person limited perspective of the story-telling, so that readers could get inside of his thoughts more (for what now seems like very tactless comedic reasons also...), but now it’s clear that he was never the perspective character at all! Considering that you don’t seem to want to put the perspective on the Rabbit during the story, this means you should make sure the whole story is written in true 3rd person, which means, unfortunately, that you cannot open with the 3rd person limited perspective of waking up into the setting through the Man’s eyes.




I’m sorry that was such a long ordeal... but I hope you found it useful! All in all it was an enjoyable read that has elements of Alice in Wonderland mixed with the feel of an absolutely lovely little novella called “The Death of Death” by K. N. Parker :)

Best wishes

NO1SY
« Last Edit: June 08, 2020, 08:17:21 PM by NO1SY »

Offline Albi

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 21
  • Gender: Male
  • Have fun and go far
    • View Profile
Re: I Never Left Without Saying Goodbye [Discussion]
« Reply #6 on: June 09, 2020, 08:43:30 AM »
Many thank for reading and the point outs (= ^ =)7

I'll be keeping in mind what you said about depicting movements on animals. I admit, the way i did it, did bother me (= ~ =)

Answering your question:
Spoiler
Why a rabbit?

Answer:
-I don't really know, looking at my notes it just says it symbolises the girl’s innocence and playfulness  (= _ =;)7
-This story was requested from someone I know as a foundation for a comic/manga, said person was the one who gave me the ideas. That person lost their passion, but i still finished the story as promised, in a not so clean state i admit.

Checking on my notes:
-a thing to point out is that I made this story and it’s characters modifiable as per request. But later on as I want to finish the story, the characters become more concrete


Lastly, if ever I come back to this story. Whatever point outs said be it good or bad, I'll heavily keep in mind (= v =)
« Last Edit: June 09, 2020, 09:09:55 AM by Albi »

Offline Coryn

  • Director of the MR Science Division
  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 21542
  • Gender: Male
  • Secretly a 13 year old girl.
    • View Profile
Re: I Never Left Without Saying Goodbye [Discussion]
« Reply #7 on: June 09, 2020, 10:41:30 PM »
Got around to chapter 3 finally. It's been busy over here.

- I'm getting a real The Five People You Meet In Heaven vibe. I guess we'll see how sad the end of this story is.

- Lyssa is definitely the kind of enemy you see in a Castlevania game. Nothing says high tower area like 'bird woman'.

- Just a point of interest, but how does the bunny's face turn red? Presumably as a rabbit her face would be covered in fur, so it's not like she can blush right? Worth thinking about how you would explain a look of embarrassment for a non human character.

- The more chapters we go in, the more the guy kinda seems like an asshole. You help clean up Lyssa's whole room and still won't call her by name? Pretty rude there guy.


Looking forward to the next chapter!

Will review stories upon request. My latest arc: http://goo.gl/KYgsfF

Offline NO1SY

  • Resident Slacker
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3318
  • Gender: Male
  • Will eat your cookies
    • View Profile
Re: I Never Left Without Saying Goodbye [Discussion]
« Reply #8 on: June 10, 2020, 05:47:11 AM »
- The more chapters we go in, the more the guy kinda seems like an asshole. You help clean up Lyssa's whole room and still won't call her by name? Pretty rude there guy.

This is actually a very good point that I missed making in my review.

Spoiler

It seems to be that the Man is supposed to be a great, romantic, thoughtful guy in all of the memories, but this is not the image that this small adventure builds of him. I would say that the Rabbit is a fine representation of the girl, but the Man’s amnesia seems to turn him into someone else...

This reinforces my previous point that there really should be instances of the Man’s behaviour that are then mirrored in the memories. This would help create some coherence. For instance If he did have a sarcastic side to him during his life, then show it a bit in the memories too.



Offline Albi

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 21
  • Gender: Male
  • Have fun and go far
    • View Profile
Re: I Never Left Without Saying Goodbye [Discussion]
« Reply #9 on: June 10, 2020, 10:42:20 AM »
After re-reading, i can agree with what you say (= ~ =)

I'm taking notes on it, many thanks (0 ^ 0)7