November 21, 2017, 10:13:19 AM

------------------------------------------

If you have Login Problems Use the Login in Top Menu Bar


------------------------------------------
If you have a problem registering here, Leave a msg at our FB Page >> Here.

Plz Don't use Hotmail to Register. You might not receive Activation mail. Use Other free mail provider like Gmail or Yahoo.






Author Topic: The Big Three Protagonists - A Short Comparision Review  (Read 635 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline legomaestro

  • High Chancellor of Righteousness
  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 18397
  • Gender: Male
  • real life has wack graphics
    • View Profile
The Big Three Protagonists - A Short Comparision Review
« on: January 21, 2017, 06:39:26 PM »
One Piece, Naruto, Bleach: The Big Three






The Big Three will be a term that sticks with me forever I'm afraid; no matter what the manga bestselling lists show currently or in the future.  Though many different anime and mange are the ones responsible for someone’s introduction to the world, these three are still the gold standard when it comes to shounen anime and manga. Even if they don’t match people’s tastes, they also make for great ways to start things off.
I want to focus on the protagonists of The Three and make my own short observations on each of them and make some comparisons. I'd love to hear your thoughts on the matter too.







First things first: Kurosaki Ichigo, because Bleach is the best (100% not biased).



Kurosaki Ichigo is a weird shounen protagonist.

 Not only is he tall as heck (15 my ass!) his moodiness is not something that's just there as a gimmick. Though he's not a dark eyed poet lamenting the evils of the world, his frustration and despair can be shown more clearly than any other of The Three. His utter defeats too, are not as graceful as what other shounen protagonists go through.

His personality is familiar: Ichigo has the characteristics of a hero: Fighting for the downtrodden and unflinching loyalty to his friends. However it's not with the goofy eyed pep of someone who knows their world is forgiving; it's with a badass determination of a fighter in the ring. You’ll never hear him shouting about how he wants to be the Soul King or the Captain Commander – He just fights to protect. 

Unfortunately it makes his character one dimensional when it comes to dialogue, but I really appreciate how Ichigo stands out on that front. Something that's nigh unforgiveable as well in his character to other shounen protagonists is his lack of interest in love or reactions on that front - He does get embarrassed when it comes up, but until the final chapter you'd really not get clues or tastes of that out of fan fiction (I know I'm going to be writing some *sob*)

What about his abilities? How is Ichigo in terms of his levelling up over the course of the series? Well, pretty standard - Fight, get beaten, train and power up, fight, get beaten, rinse and repeat. And boy have we seen some epic powerups from Ichigo. I'll always be ready to watch the first 54 episodes for that fact, and I really love his arrow-catching badassery in the 1,000 year blood war arc.

Except you don't ever know his real scale of powers. While other protagonists have a baseline by fighting not only amongst fellow companions and masters, Ichigo more often than not is the be all end all final solution to a battle. You have no idea how he'd fare against certain enemies with different abilities (Would he be able to match up against Barragan? What about Toushirou? What about Yama Ji himself? What about Haschwalth?)
While other shounen protagonists have had so many clashes with so many different characters you could play with the outcomes (Before they become their best, of course), Ichigo lacks a lot of that. And while one says plot hole, I say interesting. 

How does Ichigo match up to Goku, then? Goku is arguably The Archetype for shounen protagonists, so I’ll be comparing all of The Three to him?

Well, Ichigo’s not the smart type. He doesn't seem to eat a lot, but he is someone more interested in battle than chasing after girls, so he's surprisingly Goku like in those aspects.
Unfortunately his one-dimensionality isn't as forgivable as it is in Goku, because Bleach begged for more interactions of some kind. You can tell how much story he had to be told from the length of the first chapters, and the constant awesome colour pictures that Kubo Tite makes for him and the other characters.
All in all I find him quite memorable and unique because of that. And you can never make me forget the epicenes of him going bankai that first time against Byakuya. I can still hear the music. I can still see the blue light. (If you wanna see some action…)





Naruto.

It is sad that I need to remind myself that I like this manga quite a lot, and that I was OK with how it ended. However, the final war was so frustrating that I’ll always dock points off of him, even though Naruto was a pretty interesting character to follow.

He fits in shounen so well: He's a wimp, a loser, but has hidden talents that he develops over time. He's a loud ninja (Which at first was a fun insult to throw at him, but now I criticize him for it) who depends on power rather than subtlety. He shouts his convictions on the top of his lungs, and shows no respect for those more powerful than him. He's always been gutsy and headstrong, and the best thing is as far as his arcs go it's been a group of great mentors and great teammates that facilitate his way to victory. So, friendship power done right (I’m looking at you Fairy Tail!)

Until the final ninja arc, Naruto was very much human (ish) and relatable. He was part of the crew, but still the protagonist.

I like that he had a love interest that not only he chased after till the bitter end, but that he had an actual confrontation with (Well, Sakura tried to bait him but still, he responded with a serious face instead of embarrassment for once).

He's been down before, he's seen death before, and I felt a great respect for him when Asuma died and he was there quiet and in funeral garb comforting a crying Konohamaru. I just thought 'Yeah, Naruto has grown up, and is capable of being more than loud.'
I also did not miss the fact that he actually studies a lot! His hard work isn't just pummelling people and recovering from wounds, between the short glimpses of his room and the earlier chapter covers, you can see that Naruto forces himself to learn jutsus and the like. And I'll always enjoy his tree-climbing training.

It came as a surprise that his determination to have Sasuke as a friend was stronger than it seemed on the surface. That first bitter moment Sasuke tried to harm him on the hospital roof, the first fight by the waterfall and their final battle; I got shivers' down my spine every time.

Naruto coming to save the village in sage garb was also a grand moment too.  There is a lot of strength in this deceptively simple shounen character.

I do find myself wishing that more consequences followed his ninja path, however. Between the resurrections and the all too convenient chance to resolve everything between his mother, father and his wayward best friend, it felt like he was handled with kiddie gloves the whole way.  Jiraiya dying felt unfair in retrospect because of how much he was spared, but that's just my dark self speaking, and has nothing to do with what he is as a character.
Checking him up against Goku, he's pretty different in a lot of ways. From hair colour to struggling with every single power up, he's not like Goku at all. He did end up with someone he wasn't actively looking for. I suppose he does eat a lot too, but nothing compared to…





Monkey D. Luffy


It's funny how no one ever refers to Luffy by his surname. Not even the characters in One Piece. It's his first name or full name, never his surname. ("Hey! Monkey!" )
Anyhow.

Luffy is an idiot. Sometimes you think between those epic moments he beats someone down and declares his wish to be the pirate king, he's got some brain cells to rub together, but no, as merciless as the devil fruit is to someone's dreams of swimming, as hopeless as Zorro is in finding directions, his idiocy is legitimate grade A stone-headedness, and that's played to grand effect.

Unlike Naruto and Ichigo, Luffy refuses to look cool when he powers up. His rubber fruit powers facilitate not only the most ridiculous comedic moments, but are hard to respect - at first. Luffy makes up for his silliness for the truly desperate moments, and the moments where he is truly pissed. Then you see the veins and muscles in his fist and feel the pain of those unfortunate enough to cross him.

He's got willpower for sure, he's got dreams that he's actually more serious about than you'd think. For example his declaration that he'd quit being a pirate if Silver Rayleigh revealed what One Piece was, was quite impressive. His acceptance that Usopp should leave because he had disrespected the captain means he knows what sort of world he's in.

And it's quite interesting how he rarely fight's an enemies rhetoric with moral arguments - For him it's all about if you're hurting his nakama or not, if you're standing in his way or not. It seems quite cruel, but it's quite honest for someone who knows he's a 'bad guy' and is looking for his dreams.  He even reprimanded Coby for not sticking up to himself.

Comparing to Goku? His appetite comes to mind first. Yikes, Luffy can eat! His bone headedness is a check too for the stereotype, and his sheer lack in girls is so strong it's god level. I mean how can he ignore Boa Hancock like that?! In any case, Luffy is truly a torch bearer when it comes to being a second generation shounen protagonist. He fits the stereotypes to a T, but has his own unique spin to things. That makes him quite interesting; no matter how foolish he looks at first glance. But then again, the entire manga is an acquired taste and often ignored as a result.

In closing, I've basically just rambled what should be obvious to everyone - The big three have a lot in common because of their demographic, but they do have their own special characteristics that make people life them more or less than the others. For his sheer badassery and difference from the mould I find Ichigo to be the boss of all, but I do appreciate the other two.







I want to shortly mention that my new hopes for big shounen - My Hero Academia and Black Clover have some great protagonists. Deku is the unique one - Weak-willed but quite intelligent, and rarely the most important in the story. Asta is a muscle-brained idiot who 'wants to be the magic emperor'. He parallels quite a bit with Naruto and Luffy, while Deku is like Ichigo in his strange unique yet familiar character mould. I have high hopes for them.
My two cents.


Offline Manimal

  • God of Thunder & Rock n' Roll
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3430
  • Gender: Male
  • Kanan Ball The Future
    • View Profile
Re: The Big Three Protagonists - A Short Comparision Review
« Reply #1 on: January 21, 2017, 07:58:08 PM »
Good read Lego.

I have not gotten in any of the big three 'cuz they don't interest me but I guess there is more then just, Ichigo is dark, Naruto is Goku pt. 2 and Luffy is an idiot. Ichigo seems more interesting to me, I don't think any of them compare to Goku though. There is a guy who only cared about fighting, not his family or the world, just fighting. I like Gohan even more as he was more of a standard hero type.

The idea of the shounen protagonist is so overdone these days that it makes me sick to see the same character all the time. But all these characters have their own traits. Everyone likes a good ol' hero in these stories. The wimp who turns cool. I feel Simon the Digger is the best example of this in anime ('cuz he's from the best anime hehehehe), I also really like the dynamic with the kid & Kuroyukihime in Accel World, which I should finish. Ippo as well, how can you dislike the guy. Such an honest drive. But really that's unrelated here.

I think we can agree Natsu is fairly uninterested compare to these three. Ha ha, dude doesn't even train.
« Last Edit: January 21, 2017, 08:02:42 PM by Manimal »

Offline legomaestro

  • High Chancellor of Righteousness
  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 18397
  • Gender: Male
  • real life has wack graphics
    • View Profile
Re: The Big Three Protagonists - A Short Comparision Review
« Reply #2 on: January 21, 2017, 08:19:13 PM »
Domo.

Haha people really had problems with Gohan's superhero attempts. It went back to straight on fighting. Sometimes it works to just go for the jugular and be the genre. (Thankeeee Bikini Warriors!)

Well they're all in the same realm really. Simon could've easily been so cliche, Arita could've become Kirito if they did it wrong for him.

I really need to try Ippo at a point. I'm so, so far behind.

Offline Manimal

  • God of Thunder & Rock n' Roll
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3430
  • Gender: Male
  • Kanan Ball The Future
    • View Profile
Re: The Big Three Protagonists - A Short Comparision Review
« Reply #3 on: January 21, 2017, 08:36:52 PM »
Yes, ha again Bikini Warriors was good for what it was trying to do, poking a little fun at RPGs while also being a ballsack on the table ecchi.

Ya they are all similar, the traditional hero's journey and all of that. The big part is the progression and how it all adds up. Simon is memorable because he's such a loser in the beginning but it was always in him from when he was digging tunnels. He just needed someone to push him and a few bumps along the way to grow into the ultimate.
Spoiler
Then in the end he's forgotten and just roams the world as a weird old man. Perfect ending. Gurren Lagann was great for pulling rug under you. Like you assume Kamina is the big guy but all along it was really Simon. Even Kamina eh, he's all cool and macho but it's really to cover up his insecurities.

Ippo is SOOOO worth it. 70+ eps for season 1 but it's so satisfying and actually quite incredible. Just watch episode 1 and you'll get a good feel for the rest of the show if it's worth it for you.
« Last Edit: January 21, 2017, 08:45:20 PM by Manimal »

Offline legomaestro

  • High Chancellor of Righteousness
  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 18397
  • Gender: Male
  • real life has wack graphics
    • View Profile
Re: The Big Three Protagonists - A Short Comparision Review
« Reply #4 on: January 21, 2017, 08:46:04 PM »
I will absolutely, never, ever get over what Gurren Lagaan did to me in terms of those twists and turns. In a way, it's only studios as crazy as Gainax and Trigger that would ever get away with stuff like that. Their art suffers (I like it because of that) but because of that you can't predict what they'll make.  The best thing is that my gripes with the various endings will never be satisfied - Whether I win an argument or not I'll know what actually happened and still be surprised that it did and enjoy it all the more. This is a trait that is sorely missing in some genres.

And yeah, Bikini Warriors gets a pass for being so faithful to the genre, but stuff like Fairy Tail that don't even bother to deviate from the template become horror stories: Ther've been so many near deaths and resurrections that I am literally only reading to know how it ends at this point. It's tragic.

As for Ippo... I'm surprised you'd rate something out of your anime zone like that. Definitely going to check it out this year someway somehow.

Offline Manimal

  • God of Thunder & Rock n' Roll
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3430
  • Gender: Male
  • Kanan Ball The Future
    • View Profile
Re: The Big Three Protagonists - A Short Comparision Review
« Reply #5 on: January 21, 2017, 08:55:43 PM »
Like I say, I will never see an anime that tops Gurren Lagann for me. Of course it's the first I ever watched so it holds great value, but it's just...nothing is like that. That scale, excitement, and overly badassry. Evangelion is close for a more serious and brutal mech show, but Gurren Lagann transcends the genres. Gainax/Trigger, those guys are best, the literal best in anime I believe. Kill la Kill was pretty close for that over the top awesomeness, though it coped a little too much from Evangelion to be overly shocking and the final battle wasn't quite as amazing, however the show had such a great commentary running throughout and the characters, as well as designs, where phenomenal. Ryoko is one of the best anime leads ever.

Ya Fairy Tail is such a base shounen in many regards, the lack of death is the series biggest issue, as well as lack of development and progression in the cast. It's hella fun, and there are great fights, you just have to let the friendship and bs powerups not bother you. Dragon Ball Z had death meaning nothing, but remember in the Saiyan saga. That felt intense like...oh no they're dead dead. Afterwards it was like oh ya everyone comes and goes, but in that saga it was actually really solid.

I always like a good exciting show like that, I just don't seek them out. So whenever I do watch something like that it's an event and something more memorable. So Ippo stands as one of my top 10 anime because it just delivered.
« Last Edit: January 21, 2017, 08:58:53 PM by Manimal »

Offline legomaestro

  • High Chancellor of Righteousness
  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 18397
  • Gender: Male
  • real life has wack graphics
    • View Profile
Re: The Big Three Protagonists - A Short Comparision Review
« Reply #6 on: January 21, 2017, 09:10:29 PM »
Right on that front. Gurren freaking Lagann. One of the only anime that I forgave for a recap episode and even watched some of the movies for. They had a beach episode and were still an amazing anime.  I am always sad that I could never recommend people Kill la Kill because while it was amazing to me, they sensed that it wasn't a complete masterpiece like their other works, but still, that anime deserves a medal.

Oh gawd how did they even get permission to air that. So ecchi. *Nosebleed*

Mashima actually knows how to make manga with narrative (Rave master was great) but Fairy Tail is a cop out and a half. I'm always surprised at how low it goes. Seriously one of the latest plot developments was that a girl had to strip to give body heat to a dying protagonist. I didn't even understand what I had just read and thought it was a gag. He knows how to draw ecchi, but it's at a point where it gets in the way of the story dammit.


Haha, have you already posted a top ten anime on the forum somewhere?

Offline Manimal

  • God of Thunder & Rock n' Roll
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3430
  • Gender: Male
  • Kanan Ball The Future
    • View Profile
Re: The Big Three Protagonists - A Short Comparision Review
« Reply #7 on: January 21, 2017, 09:16:02 PM »
Kill la Kill is great and achieved what it wanted to very well but yes it's a few points down from a masterpiece. I would still recommend it, I've found that even casual viewers I've met like the show.

Fairy Tail...ya. After the amazing Master Hades fight I started to really notice all it's problems, it didn't bug me too much until the 2014 series.

My top 10 shows I have done. I will likely bring back the topic for an update but for now a quicklist. Most of these shows had great emotional impact and I connected to them in profound manners.
Spoiler
  • Gurren Lagann
  • Full Metal Panic!
  • Clannad After Story
  • White Album 2
  • K-ON!
  • Shakugan no Shana
  • Dragon Ball Z
  • Neon Genesis Evangelion
  • Little Busters Refrain
  • Hajime no Ippo
« Last Edit: January 21, 2017, 09:18:39 PM by Manimal »

Offline legomaestro

  • High Chancellor of Righteousness
  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 18397
  • Gender: Male
  • real life has wack graphics
    • View Profile
Re: The Big Three Protagonists - A Short Comparision Review
« Reply #8 on: January 21, 2017, 09:20:46 PM »
Damn, when the hell will I eat my words and finish Full Metal and Clannad? I can't possibly go on claiming I like anime when I don't watch those two darnit. 2017 must be the year I finally get back in the zone.

Offline Manimal

  • God of Thunder & Rock n' Roll
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3430
  • Gender: Male
  • Kanan Ball The Future
    • View Profile
Re: The Big Three Protagonists - A Short Comparision Review
« Reply #9 on: January 21, 2017, 09:27:54 PM »
Dude, Full Metal Panic finish it in time for 4.

Sorry I'm still exploding inside over that. Full. Metal. Panic. 4. I'm so worried but also so jazzed. Gurren Lagann and Full Metal Panic I both watched right at the end of what could be called my childhood, as in just before I turned 13, hence teen. So both are very fond for that but they are also just great shows. One of my best ani-memories is huddling in my bed with my good ol' portable DVD player and watching FMP from the discs I rented for free at the comic shop. I was like "romance and school? Not interested I just want mechs". Then I was like "never mind".

Clannad, I mean it has issues in the first season but it just...no other anime made me shed tears. It was an experience like no other. I would recommend White Album 2 over it as it's a tighter narrative and overall stronger character story but really that'll just make you feel like garbage for a few days after watching.

Also never underestimate K-ON. It's secretly brilliant in ways you don't realize until you rewatch it.
« Last Edit: January 21, 2017, 09:37:08 PM by Manimal »

Offline legomaestro

  • High Chancellor of Righteousness
  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 18397
  • Gender: Male
  • real life has wack graphics
    • View Profile
Re: The Big Three Protagonists - A Short Comparision Review
« Reply #10 on: January 21, 2017, 09:45:08 PM »
I shall always underestimate K-ON haha, but I'll trust your reviews.

I think what I need is the ability to watch anime under my sheets. My desktop computer is getting in the way. I'll see if I can arrange a binge watch in-the-blankets vanishing like the good old days.

I keep on forgetting that Full Metal 4 is appearing. I need to keep with the times goshdarnit.

Offline Manimal

  • God of Thunder & Rock n' Roll
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3430
  • Gender: Male
  • Kanan Ball The Future
    • View Profile
Re: The Big Three Protagonists - A Short Comparision Review
« Reply #11 on: January 21, 2017, 09:52:49 PM »
Again I don't think K-ON is too appealing if you don't like moe, or atleast don't let it out and let it in. Those characters are a lot more fleshed out then one could imagine you know. You may not like it if you don't like moe but it also might make you like moe. Because it's not like the other shows, there is just something about it.

I used to watch shows and stuff like that but it never works with my laptop, it's been forever since I tried though. But unlike when I was 12 I'll just fall asleep that way most likely. I've fallen asleep accidentally by reading manga and suddenly the album playing is on a different song. It's like...wait this is not right. FMP 4 man! I'm so worried but still. This Fall, as long as it doesn't get delayed or randomly canned.
« Last Edit: January 21, 2017, 10:12:41 PM by Manimal »

Offline legomaestro

  • High Chancellor of Righteousness
  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 18397
  • Gender: Male
  • real life has wack graphics
    • View Profile
Re: The Big Three Protagonists - A Short Comparision Review
« Reply #12 on: January 21, 2017, 11:14:40 PM »
I'll try to give it the benefit of doubt that I shared Madoka then, if it's really that worth a recommendation. Moe works for me so long as it doesn't have that horrifying sense of emptiness. I mean Higurashi is amazing to me, Suzumiya Haruhi too. Actually there's quite a bit of anime I've seen with a moe factor that have something going for them... But then there's a lot on the other side that just use moe without even looking good.


Ah the good old days of energy are gone. Now is the age of being a whipper snapper.

Are there people around you that are hyped for it too? Strange enough FMP 4 has a low key status as an epic anime. I do acknowledge its status but it's not as obvious as say Gurren Lagaan

Offline Manimal

  • God of Thunder & Rock n' Roll
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3430
  • Gender: Male
  • Kanan Ball The Future
    • View Profile
Re: The Big Three Protagonists - A Short Comparision Review
« Reply #13 on: January 21, 2017, 11:22:38 PM »
K-ON is something hard to describe for me. It goes beyond simple moe, I need to write an essay on it like I did KISS. Love Live is simple cute girls fun but K-ON is like...something else.

Um no not really. Full Metal Panic isn't a standard anime classic or massive title of greatness. It's a well liked series and I've seen hype on MAL for sure, but it's not like AOT 2 or OPM 2 levels. Because its worlds better then both of those shows imo. Ha ha. FMP is a personal classic for me.

As long as the mechs arent CG, the story progresses well, its fun and Mikuni Shimokawa does the OP & ED it should be fine.
« Last Edit: January 21, 2017, 11:24:29 PM by Manimal »

Offline MahluaandMilk

  • Queen of Lurking Losers / Ms. Fanservice
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1824
  • Gender: Female
  • Don't mind me, just being my friends' other mom.
    • View Profile
Re: The Big Three Protagonists - A Short Comparision Review
« Reply #14 on: January 22, 2017, 07:02:10 PM »
Gonna derail your conversation and go back to the big three.

People tend to like what they can relate to, so if you start with someone who feels like they can't do anything, you have something majority of society is. Then, you take that and you put in hard work and hope and you have what people wish they could do but usually don't in life. Then you show them success, and it makes them feel happy. That's why, I think, zero-to-hero characters who are pretty goofy tend to be so popular. People relate to the struggle to be validated, especially with friends, so of course when the friendship card is played, people feel that.

Wow that sounds really distant and kinda not quite what I mean to frame this as but eh.
"My manner of thinking, so you say, cannot be approved. Do you suppose I care? A poor fool indeed is he who adopts a manner of thinking for others!"--Marquis de Sade
"A loss of innocence / one hand to wash the other / be a perfectionist / you're nothing if you're just another"--TBM, "Goodnight"
Got Ecchi? Join us.