The story of Mizuka

[Thy Obsessive Freak]

Yeah, not really sure what to do with the rest of the comic up in my art gallery. http://forums.mangaraiders.com/index.php/topic,8376.0.html

But for now I'm posting what I update here at least. Following two pages of the Story of Mizuka.

This was really hard for me to though and probably a bit too advanced for my skills. But in the second page at least, there was meant to be a lot more Dhearm dancing around. But it just looked like a jumbled mess, due to space and perspective issues. So I didn't both and hope it looks alright, even though a tad lazy due to fatigue and frustration (This took a while to do). Anyways, hope to get some feedback related to hindsight (I've already done most this scene on paper/traditional art) as I feel there would've been a better and easier way to have done these two pages.

[Thy Obsessive Freak]

I just managed to get three pages up in one day 

[Lumaria]

Did you do all this on computer? How well can you draw by hand on paper?

I suggest working by hand to learn perspective. And use an outline so you can know what type of proportions you want on your characters. The hair looks odd with the one with purple dress.

As for story its hard to understand what's going on with the subtle hints included.

[Thy Obsessive Freak]

What? I like Kunaga's hair?
As for the story, did you see the link I left at the top that has the rest of the story. Apologies, I don't mean to sound rude or anything, but I've had a number of readers who are very into the story, so I'm just concerned if it's because you haven't read the rest. If you have, fair enough or if it's not to do with that then, yeah? Going to have to elaborate.
Also I do this on paper first, then digitally go over it.

But thank you, your efforts to help is much appreciated.

[Lumaria]

More like all the hair of the characters. I also see a lot of praise when it comes to other works. I simply expect the best....and if I don't see it, I tell you what to work on. You should be glad I'm assuming you want to be an aspiring comic artist.

Again, its better to make some form of outline to get the proportions of your characters right. You seem to draw only left, right, front and back view. You don't draw at angles, for example if a character was turning their head while keeping their body still. Try learning how to draw an actual body so you can get the proportions well balanced between panels.

Learning to draw your character at different angles helps you give them more defining features and dimension. And it helps define hair features aswell. Once you do that you would be willing to do more daring details, such as how armor fits into your character, and how well you design them. That one character had a very plain purple dress.

As for your story (read from the link provided) Usually for a 1st chapter it doesn't involve so much details being introduced. Or rather they divide the long explanations into different panels. And its difficult to understand the basics. The introduction didn't go into key specifics. For example: long ago in World A there were X ammount of races living in harmony. One day Evil race B came in and attempted to destroy it all. Etc. Etc.

You only gave details to 1 race while the rest were left to mystery.

[Thy Obsessive Freak]

Issue resolved

[Suuper-san]

@lorenx1 your criticisms are mostly true but i think if you phrased it a bit less aggressively it might have gone down a bit better, although theres nothing you actually said that was argumentative, its just a feel to it. also on your previous comment, even if you drew with a tablet on computer, thats not such a bad way to learn to draw

@obsessive since lorenx gave good criticism i would try and pick out the points that were good criticism and take the other points as just badly phrased. for example, you do tend to avoid drawing 3/4 views on a character. while you have drawn them before i do recommend you try and put some mroe in for variety.

i think when lorenx said "try drawing a person", im pretty sure he meant something like "it would be good if you could draw a person from many angles, showing you understand well the construction of the body". this criticism goes for anyone really, myself included.

i like the new pages, my favourite line being "he didnt lose his capabilities as a charmer"
i have to go now but i will edit back with something else i wanted to say

[Thy Obsessive Freak]

Thanks suupertramp, I was just trying to give Lorenix my own criticism, such as highlighting her bad word choice. (Well through my experience of telling people their works crud, I get backlash simply because I choose something wrong to say). But I will try to do more 3/4 views and angles then.

Thanks anyways suupertramp and good luck with trying with trying to save those children from evil galaticus (Sorry, but you saved this here, you have suuper in your name and your flying off now, joke worth trying to do)

[Suuper-san]

happy to help :P

oh yeah i was gonna say
you spelt it nunsance but its nonsense (as in non-sense - making no sense)

and regarding the introduction of juzumi, i think while still good as it is, the panels could have been swapped round to make his entrance a bit more dramatic, since the girl didnt know he was injured, could have made it a bit more shocking, perhaps showing a flashback picture of what he used to look like, or a couple of panels flashback of him saving everyone, with the speech bubbles of the prince and the girl over the top of the flashback as he explains it. hope that made sense :P

[Thy Obsessive Freak]

you spelt it nunsance but its nonsense (as in non-sense - making no sense)

....Darn fecking typos! Hate them so much... Going to have to read over my dialogue a lot more... Or see if I can get a spell checker on Manga studios.

Anyways yeah, while colouring in the comic, I realized on hindsight, should've done a flashback instead. But you know, already traditionally drawn this and I love progress more than I do process. Overall you're right and I wish I had done that.

[Thy Obsessive Freak]

Managed to do more and finish another scene. To note I don't do 3 on a regular basis I just wanted to see if I would actually manage to accomplish this scene... It was very hard with the background required.

[Lumaria]

Now why does that sound offensive? Don't you think I'm trying to draw an actual body? I've been drawing for 2yrs, step-by-step tutorials, real life sketches and even going through books from Andrew Loomis. So please don't assume I've been trying to draw pigs? If you don't mind me saying. Should really learn your choice of words when critiquing people's works.

Don't get easily offended. I'm telling you draw an actual body. As in an actual person that you see in front of you, not the misproportioned figures you draw. 2 years is A LOT of time to improve on. And (now don't get offended) but this doesn't look like work that took two years of improvement. Drawing more people should help you build more defining features to your characters figures.

This should only encourage you to work at a more faster pace. I've said it before and I'll say it again: I give you what you need to hear. I'm not here to baby anyone, I'm not here to tickle your ears.. I'm here to help those who need it and have the stomach to actually hear what they need.

Also have to defend my story if you don't mind. Sorry but it's the way I choose to tell it and feel I must explain it.
Have you thought that's only how much information I wanted to tell the reader?

You have had a poor way of doing it. Just because it was by choice doesn't mean its a good choice. That's something that you will learn.

Through my literature, I tell the reader what he wants to know about the story. I was going to involve a lot more races as well as civilizations and politics, but the introduction was hogging up a lot space and I wanted to get right down to the story and so I told the reader what they needed to know, about the Dharem, there are daemons, people are basically DBZ fighters and there's an feck load of mythology. Bam, all you're going to need to know, anymore you want to know, you can find out from my character it goes into more detail about the world.

The introduction took more space because you chose to make it that way. Half of the things in the introduction were unnecessary. You mentioned a world with many names (could've easily defined the world by giving it a proper name), with many theories of creation (I'm sure the real way will be revealed in the plot so there's no point in making a panel for theories), and the only one that matters is the race you actually expanded on and the theory they perceive. So 2/3 of the introduction didn't really offer anything.

Sorry, I think being confused over the story simply because of 'key specifics' not be shown to you is not understandable to me.

often times, when you're creating a fantasy world, you need key specific details that makes your fantasy world "yours". This is what most manga follow because theirs always works that look the same. Your story jumps right in, but we can't see what makes your world different from the others.

You only have one race introduced, but you have no specific name for your world and no specific races.

Again I appreciate you trying to give feedback and trying to help and I am glad you are telling me to work on, but I'm honest as well... Also arrogant, egotistical and I love myself a little too much. But looking at the first line again of your latest post, I'm now jumping to assumptions here, but I feel you find something's wrong with praise helping people to improve their work. It relieves people and helps them insure they don't have to focus or strain themselves on it too much. I'm just recently learning that my fight scenes aren't as bad as I thought it was and my facial expressions are good that I'm learning what makes my work good and what makes it valuable, also it motivates me and know I'm doing it correctly.

Here is something you should know. I gave you advice to improve on. Giving you advice shows that the critic sees potential. That alone should be enough motivation than praise alone. Praise is good for only one thing and one thing only: to give confidence.

Also you should learn to praise people's work as well as tell it's a pile of crud. No offense of course, but it's the critic's ultimate defense. If you keep telling all this criticism, the artist will assume you're just trying to be mean and unfair. Imagine a janitor who just mopped an entire school floor, your the principal and you come along tell how he missed a spot, how do you think the janitor would feel after working for hours doing all that work, let alone his relations with the principal now. Make sure to give the praise first as well, yes,, first appearances and all that (Give a friendly attitude first before a nasty one) it's possible that the artist might just flounder over the praise and ignore your criticism, but then he was just a waste of your time to begin with. Those who can take in both your praise and criticism, are well potential artists.
Just saying all this from my experience of telling people mean things about their literature work, but having them actually improve it. I just felt I needed it mentioned.

That's what I been doing. Don't see it? That's on you.

[Thy Obsessive Freak]

Issue resolved

[Thy Obsessive Freak]

Dang it all to high heaping heaven! Just realized in the opening of my comic there was some pages I forgot to insert! Gah! Hate it when I do stuff like that!

[Lumaria]

Wow this is really going no where and I see your being quite aggressive. I will add that you should be giving praise and advice. All your doing after all is giving advice and I feel it's not very appropriate. Giving praise is being friendly, giving confidence (As you said) and motivates them to keep going.

But I assume your just going to argue or something. So what I'm going to do, is to do what's in my right... Ignore you. Yep, immature, but better than just arguing with a person who I feel is being aggressive, stubborn, negative and impolite. (Sorry but assuming I haven't been working everyday for over 2yrs is offense as it's assuming as if I've just been lying on my ass staring outside the window rarely opening my sketch book to draw)

Oh please, now you're just putting words in my mouth. I'm saying the progress has been excrusiatingly slow. I won't give praise unless you deserve It. To assume you've been working everyday for 2 years is a bit of exagerration because improvement doesn't come from how much time you spent working on it. You should be getting some form of "dimension" within those years if you've been studying and working on it everyday. Something that lacks a lot in your work. And I say that because those are the very basics before working on a comic. Learning perspective and dimension. So how is anyone going to assume you've been working hard on your artwork for 2 solid years with the artwork that lacks the basics???

Even if you claim your artwork you show now is outdated. You can't really blame me for critiqueing work that doesn't show the skills you have now.

Am I stubborn? When it comes to improving yes. There's nothing wrong with that. Am I aggressive? Not at first, I gave you advice. Now it may not have been what you wanted, but its what you needed in order to improve. I'm simply being aggressive now because you want to hear what you want. You threw away perfectly good acceptable advice. The first thing you mentioned was disbelief of how many people have given you praise on it.

but I'm honest as well... Also arrogant, egotistical and I love myself a little too much.

Its hypocritical to accuse me of being "arrogant" when your all that and more, and worst you admit it.

I'm not wrong to give you praise, you have plenty of people giving you that and its feeding the arrogance, the egotism enough. You don't need anymore. And ignoring me is not only childish and immature out of behaviour, but immature in the sense you can't even gain any thing out of advice unless it comes with praise.